Today’s Team: Studebakers
H/H Lost Of Lordaeron (Shadow Shock, Arcane Explosion, Curse Of Doom)
S/S Enchanted Broom (Broom, Sweep, Wind-Up)
B/B Lifelike Toad (Tongue Lash, Cleansing Rain, Frog Kiss)
Rationale:
I started with the Lost Of Lordaeron. I’ve been having some fun with that pet due to it having some nice damage against Anubisath Idols and also because of Arcane Explosion. I know I’ve talked some smack in the past about Arcane Explosion spammers and how ineffective it is, but I have to say it’s damn fun when people leave their flyers on the back line. Usually by the time my ghost is dead the birds or moths have lost their racial bonus. I really didn’t realize I had it out for flyers so bad; it must be because of all the grief they gave me in 5.3 when my favorite pets were a basilisk, undead crab and mongoose. After I chose the big ghost I added the Lifelike Toad. I’ve had reasonable success with it lately. I’ve actually beaten a few Consume Corpse teams when Tongue Lash hits all three times on multiple turns. Yeah, I know that’s lucky, but it’s still nice taking down valk/consume teams. Frog Kiss and Cleansing Rain have some synergy, too. I threw in the Enchanted Broom to add some speed and utility with Sweep and also some bang with Wind-Up. For a team that doesn’t have any of the current big shot pets on it so far it’s been doing okay. Not the team of the century by any means, but whenever I can pull off wins with lesser used pets I consider it successful venture.
Concerns:
I have a love/hate relationship with Frog Kiss. I really don’t like relying on having to get lucky with polymorph (stun) moves to win. However, Frog Kiss can hit really hard once it ramps up. I think of it as a ramp-up move with an extra benefit. I also feel that it is broken, that Resilience should proc sooner that it does in order to disallow chain stuns.
The Opposing Team:
S/S Jademist Dancer
P/P Emperor Crab
H/P Blighthawk
I think those were the breeds, my opponent didn’t stick around long enough for me to get a good look.
The Battle:
How sweet is that? One of the two toughest teams to beat in the current meta (along with Consume Corpse). I still run a clonedance team occasionally when I want easy wins. It’s pretty damn hard to lose with. This team I faced has the extra annoyance of an Emperor Crab. Man, I wish Emperor Crabs didn’t bore me to death since they’re so hard to take down. Why am I pleased to face such a powerful team? I have a powerful counter (at least in theory) to this team with my Lifelike Toad. It has strong attacks against the Blighthawk and Jademist Dancer and doesn’t take strong damage from Cyclone like aquatic frogs/toads. Plus, my Enchanted Broom will take weak damage from all the aquatic damage. Overall I was in good shape.
So what happened? My opponent started with the crab against my mech toad. They immediately swapped to the Blighthawk, they must have been saving the crab for the Lost Of Lordaeron. I don’t remember which attack I used (the logs went away due me logging out >.<), but the Blighthawk took a hit on the swap. It took a strong Tongue Lash as it put down the Cyclone. Then the Jademist Dancer came in and got pounded by Frog Kiss as it cast Rain Dance. I’m pretty sure there were multiple crits for me so far so my opponent may have felt victimized my rng. The final straw for them was the Emperor Crab getting poly’d by the Lifelike Toad. I was trying to figure out if I was going to Tongue Lash or not to make sure that I didn’t chain poly, but my opponent took the decision out of my hands by running away. Nice job mech toad! I guess it really does work on clonedance teams. Like I said, I got some crits to help me, but I’m still pleased with the performance of the Lifelike Toad against a team that probably has a 90-95% win rate. Damn, they ran before I could get a decent screenshot.
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On the subject of arcane explosion, I actually toyed with a gimmicky sunlight team that employed it. Part of the lineup was Chrominus. Sunlight means that you can activate the dragonkin racial every other turn, which compensates for AE being on the weaker side. Ancient Blessing helps keep it alive. And then if you use the dragonkin racial with Surge of Power, that’s ~1100 damage noncrit to use as a final attack.
Ultimately it was super gimmicky because I had no idea what other pets to use with that, and singing sunflowers aren’t very strong pets either. But I thought it made AE a viable pick.
Creative use of Sunlight and Chrominius.
Perhaps Blossoming Ancient is a better option, if you got that one.
I just gotta try this, but I’m putting my faith in Sunfur Panda and perhaps a mech with repair.
I don’t have an ancient. Sunfur Panda is really kinda bad in my experience, sadly. It’s hibernate is pretty weak due to low power, and you leave it vulnerable sitting out there, whereas the sunflower can heal in the back row.
I would have to agree with you after trying it out. It needs the Crouch to Hibernate, but then of course it loses Sunlight.
Not that I don’t respect the blighthawk and the benefit of the UD racial but I think almost any flyer is better for clonedancers due to the numerous undead beaters you see in PvP and the fact that the hawk is so slow
Not to mention the uptick in popularity of aqua pets in PvP lately… A flyer is handy ..I even tried an s/s raven as a 3rd wheel on a dancer team and it performed well
My meta is FILLED with fliers, Moths, Ravens, Seagulls you name it. I am using the Lifelike Toad to mess with their heads but I’m still losing fairly regularly, what’s the best against 2 fliers and a humanoid? (generally anub idol or sandling or fiendish imp)
Emerald Proto Whelp is my favourite vs flyers, but is at a disadvantage against a humanoid (although sandstorm plus emerald presence would give him a double shield and he might be OK).
This may sound a little weird, but try a P/S jademist dancer using jade claw instead of steam vent.
Since it’s elemental, it puts nocturnal strike down to a 50% hit move, ignores darkness and sandstorm accuracy debuffs, and jade claw is a magic move.
I used the Jademist Dancer like this in the beginning of 5.4 then felt like a dimwit for not realizing the potential of Rain Dance
Like Loki said the EPW would work nicely against fliers. But of course it is weak against Call Darkness and if paired with an Idol it would suffer. Should be great against other fliers and no problem with the Imp or Sandling.
Recently I have used the Spirit Crab alot and Surge/Shell really hampers fliers attempts to damage it. Crow/Raven will still hurt alot with Call Darkness + Nocturnal Strike so avoid those. But Moths and Seagulls will be at a disadvantage. Shell helps against the small attacks from Alpha Strike and Slicing Wind. Surge will further reduce Alpha Strike damage. Against Moths you can use surge then use Shell when they Cocoon Strike.
I hardly dare mention the Nether Rays. These fliers have both Arcane Blast that is strong against fliers, and Shadow Shock that is strong against humanoids. But myself I have never had much sucess with these pets.
Two things I try to use against Raven/Crow/Dread Hatchling is first to have a beast pet up to take the Call Darkness(weak against beasts), if the beast has weather change spell so much better.
Secondly after darkness is up you know Nocturnal Strike will come, birds almost never delay it since they want to use two nocturnal strike in one darkness. You can either switch in an elemental no nerf their nocturnal strike hit chance or switch in a dragon that will take much less damage. There are elementals with strong vs birds attacks, Ominous Flame/Jadefire Spirit/Jademist Dancer, but any elemental will do well. I have recently been using Deathtalon Whelpguard, and it does not take much damamge from fliers if you avoid the darkness. It can also stun if an Idol is switched in or you can go with Whirlwind for some AoE.
One thing that truly nerfs fliers is AoE, if you can damage them enough they will lose their racial while in back line. Migh be hard with Idol or Sandling of course.
Thanks everyone good suggestions, I have always used my Emerald Proto Drake for fliers but in PVP I find it too slow. Going to definately try out the Clouded Hedgehog (I already really like the Vengeful Porcupette, but an S/S sounds interesting)
If the EPW is too slow for you, consider trying a Sprite Darter Hatchling or a Nether Faerie Dragon. It won’t be faster than really fast pets, which will put you at a disadvantage, but with a weather change, magic damage, and a dodge move, you can mess up a bird’s day. My Sprite Darter has been a very strong go-to pet for a while now. I started using it same as Disco, to throw out moonlight for Xu-Fu. But it kicked more butt than Xu-Fu ever did. I’ve taken out entire teams with it.
It’s like my Sprite Darter Hatchling is in the top percentage of Sprite Darter Hatchlings.
The downside is that the SDH or NFD depends heavily on mind games. It’s all about weather denial and that dodge move. If you can play your opponent, you can trash them. My meta isn’t terribly bright, though. So I never have any trouble mind-gaming people. For your specific problem, you can swap weather on a Sandling or Idol, denying them the advantage of sandstorm. Or letting yourself get beat up and then Life Exchange to munch on their delicious H/H Hit points. I’ve been running my SDH alongside my Emperor Crab, letting the Moonlight buff the Crab’s healing to even more absurd heights.
I find I get a mix between bright and dim…generally people are wise however ie I do a darkness and they switch to an elemental etc. I kind of like the idea of outplaying your opponent, even when you being able to say “good game!” rather than “$#%#$ing RNG!” is always better.
Try an S/S clouded hedgehog vs fliers. Bite, spiked skin and powerball (Although survival is good too).